tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8951904624959546499.post1415772547234625392..comments2009-03-30T11:22:42.373-04:00Eric Jacobsonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08216361684596485033noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8951904624959546499.post-15798690600856287282009-03-30T08:17:00.000-04:002009-03-30T08:17:00.000-04:00Thanks Eric for answering my question!!<BR/><BR/>I will try to convince my tester using a combination of carrot and stick method.<BR/><BR/>Like Danny R. Faught 's article in stickymind says we can use the skills to isolate the bugs more than looking at the code and helping to fix it.Roshni Princenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8951904624959546499.post-1591476618437844112009-03-28T17:40:00.000-04:002009-03-28T17:40:00.000-04:00I, like Alex, prefer the smarty-pants testers. In my post about what I think the next version of a tester should be (http://blog.theautomatedtester.co.uk/2008/07/tester-20-definition-of-agile-tester.html). <BR/><BR/>I don't think that a tester should be writing all the production code but there should not be afraid to go in and fix code if they have to.David Burnshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11233457684822187675noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8951904624959546499.post-62970122596129172392009-03-26T15:33:00.000-04:002009-03-26T15:33:00.000-04:00Interesting question! I took some time to formulate my answer in the Software Alchemy blog - <A HREF="http://blogs.stickyminds.com/Blogs/tabid/91/EntryId/68/Who-fixes-the-bugs.aspx" REL="nofollow">Who fixes the bugs?</A>Danny R. Faughthttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06177507340549951750noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8951904624959546499.post-5215991654045492192009-03-26T09:36:00.000-04:002009-03-26T09:36:00.000-04:00Smarty Pants Testers are okay as long as in the end you still find the issues and hit your deadlines.Jay Philipshttp://jayphilips.myopenid.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8951904624959546499.post-62840398029306567922009-03-26T08:37:00.000-04:002009-03-26T08:37:00.000-04:00Alex,<BR/><BR/>Yes, SmartyPantsTester should automate business logic and work closely with the developer. That is testing! <BR/><BR/>Roshni Prince's question and my post was directed towards testers that try to fix their own bugs (or at least tell the devs how to fix them). That is not testing.<BR/><BR/>I'm certainly not saying a tester with coding skills is a bad thing! As long as they use those skills to collect information about the quality of the AUT, they are being good testers. <BR/><BR/>I do love your post and I agree with everything you said. Although, I'm still skeptical about part of it...more later.Eric Jacobsonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08216361684596485033noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8951904624959546499.post-45239808409627447392009-03-25T21:27:00.000-04:002009-03-25T21:27:00.000-04:00I'll take smarty-pants any day of the week! I want him pairing with a developer, writing test code while the developer writes feature code. Then, using his superior testing skills to ferret out any additional tests needed before check-in. <BR/><BR/>Then, upon check-in, all of the automated acceptance tests he wrote earlier along with the unit and integration tests he just collaborated on would run. <BR/><BR/>Now we have time to do those deep, and expansive exploratory tests we wanted to do that we couldn't do because we were spending our time checking business logic through the UI.<BR/><BR/>If smarty-pants truly has the skills of an expert tester and decent coding chops, that should be exploited, not suppressed. Use your people in ways that will make them most effective.Alexhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07298916960841993037noreply@blogger.com